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	<title>Comments on: Phone Call from a Fundie</title>
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	<description>Keeping the Radical Right at Bay</description>
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		<title>By: Sue Blue</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28595</link>
		<dc:creator>Sue Blue</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 23:30:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28595</guid>
		<description>The irony meter just pegs on this one.  Here are these christians with their supposed mandate from god to charge uninvited into other countries, build churches, pass out bibles, indoctrinate children, and generally make racist, bigoted pests of themselves - and then they bitch, piss and moan when they&#039;re told in no uncertain terms that their religion is not wanted.  Why, they cry, can&#039;t these heathens see that Gawd and Jeebus are reaching out to them in the form of pasty, obnoxious foreigners?  Why oh why aren&#039;t they more grateful?  Wel, if we can&#039;t win them over by any other means, we&#039;ll just pass us some laws!  That&#039;ll melt their hearts for sure!

This sucks on so many levels.  Even if such a measure wasn&#039;t binding, it would give the godbots a legal leg to stand on when they try to sneak their crap into schools, etc.  I think anti-defamation or discrimination laws should be restricted to protecting only those attributes people have no choice in, such as race, ethnicity, gender and sexual orientation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The irony meter just pegs on this one.  Here are these christians with their supposed mandate from god to charge uninvited into other countries, build churches, pass out bibles, indoctrinate children, and generally make racist, bigoted pests of themselves &#8211; and then they bitch, piss and moan when they&#8217;re told in no uncertain terms that their religion is not wanted.  Why, they cry, can&#8217;t these heathens see that Gawd and Jeebus are reaching out to them in the form of pasty, obnoxious foreigners?  Why oh why aren&#8217;t they more grateful?  Wel, if we can&#8217;t win them over by any other means, we&#8217;ll just pass us some laws!  That&#8217;ll melt their hearts for sure!</p>
<p>This sucks on so many levels.  Even if such a measure wasn&#8217;t binding, it would give the godbots a legal leg to stand on when they try to sneak their crap into schools, etc.  I think anti-defamation or discrimination laws should be restricted to protecting only those attributes people have no choice in, such as race, ethnicity, gender and sexual orientation.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Britton</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28352</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Britton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 02:36:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28352</guid>
		<description>I was never worried.  I just wrote that &quot;save the Bay of Fundie!&quot; thing as a rhetorical device to demonstrate that I really am opposed to that resolution, even though I implied otherwise to the Christian.

The Defamation of Religions resolution is entirely about free speech, which is a basic human right.  It&#039;s interesting that the ACLJ is marketing their opposition solely on the grounds of Christian persecution.  If Muslims weren&#039;t imprisoning and torturing Christians for proselytizing and trying to convert Muslims, I wonder where they would stand on this issue.  In other words, if it were merely about the &quot;defamation&quot; of religion, wouldn&#039;t the Christian fundies be standing with their Muslim fundie brothers?  Both camps act massively bent out of shape when anybody says anything bad about their religion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was never worried.  I just wrote that &#8220;save the Bay of Fundie!&#8221; thing as a rhetorical device to demonstrate that I really am opposed to that resolution, even though I implied otherwise to the Christian.</p>
<p>The Defamation of Religions resolution is entirely about free speech, which is a basic human right.  It&#8217;s interesting that the ACLJ is marketing their opposition solely on the grounds of Christian persecution.  If Muslims weren&#8217;t imprisoning and torturing Christians for proselytizing and trying to convert Muslims, I wonder where they would stand on this issue.  In other words, if it were merely about the &#8220;defamation&#8221; of religion, wouldn&#8217;t the Christian fundies be standing with their Muslim fundie brothers?  Both camps act massively bent out of shape when anybody says anything bad about their religion.</p>
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		<title>By: LadyRavana</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28350</link>
		<dc:creator>LadyRavana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 01:47:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28350</guid>
		<description>According to the above post Ron, it looks like you have nothing to worry about. Bay of Fundie is here to stay after all! Yay!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>According to the above post Ron, it looks like you have nothing to worry about. Bay of Fundie is here to stay after all! Yay!</p>
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		<title>By: Norm</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28320</link>
		<dc:creator>Norm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 14:54:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28320</guid>
		<description>&quot;International law&quot; is a myth - there is no such thing. What exists are multi-national treaties signed by various nations. Each nation agrees to abide by terms set out in the treaty.  For example, war crimes treaties, trade agreements, etc. But in every case where the US signs on to a treaty, the terms of the treaty must comport with the US Constitution for the US to follow it - sovereignty. In the instances where the treaty contained a term that is contrary to US law (and it happens sometimes), the US law trumps the contrary treaty term.

Thus, some &quot;defamation of religion law&quot; that aims to restrict expression against some religion, EVEN IF the US were to sign on to it, would be unenforceable in the US due to the First Amendment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;International law&#8221; is a myth &#8211; there is no such thing. What exists are multi-national treaties signed by various nations. Each nation agrees to abide by terms set out in the treaty.  For example, war crimes treaties, trade agreements, etc. But in every case where the US signs on to a treaty, the terms of the treaty must comport with the US Constitution for the US to follow it &#8211; sovereignty. In the instances where the treaty contained a term that is contrary to US law (and it happens sometimes), the US law trumps the contrary treaty term.</p>
<p>Thus, some &#8220;defamation of religion law&#8221; that aims to restrict expression against some religion, EVEN IF the US were to sign on to it, would be unenforceable in the US due to the First Amendment.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Britton</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28300</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Britton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 03:43:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28300</guid>
		<description>Norm:

I&#039;m no expert on international law, but you are correct.  If the UN passes some sort of resolution, it doesn&#039;t have any enforcement power inside the US.  We&#039;d have to sign it or ratify it or something.  There&#039;s no way we would ever do that.  So I&#039;m not worried about it taking effect within the US.

I am concerned that such a thing would be implemented in other countries.  Europe, for example, has bent over backward to placate the extreme Muslims.  Look at the Danish cartoon controversy from a few years ago.  The entire European continent should have told the Muslims to shut the hell up.  If they can&#039;t stand freedom of speech, they should move (back) to a country that doesn&#039;t have it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Norm:</p>
<p>I&#8217;m no expert on international law, but you are correct.  If the UN passes some sort of resolution, it doesn&#8217;t have any enforcement power inside the US.  We&#8217;d have to sign it or ratify it or something.  There&#8217;s no way we would ever do that.  So I&#8217;m not worried about it taking effect within the US.</p>
<p>I am concerned that such a thing would be implemented in other countries.  Europe, for example, has bent over backward to placate the extreme Muslims.  Look at the Danish cartoon controversy from a few years ago.  The entire European continent should have told the Muslims to shut the hell up.  If they can&#8217;t stand freedom of speech, they should move (back) to a country that doesn&#8217;t have it.</p>
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		<title>By: Norm</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28296</link>
		<dc:creator>Norm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 02:50:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28296</guid>
		<description>The United Nations passing a &quot;Defamation of Religion&quot; law? That&#039;s amusing. They can enact any &quot;international law&quot; they want. It won&#039;t affect anyone in the U.S., as it will have no jurisdiction over our sovereignty.  In other words, the US Constitution trumps it. They cannot use it against anyone in a U.S. court of law, nor can they use it to extradite someone from the U.S. to another country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The United Nations passing a &#8220;Defamation of Religion&#8221; law? That&#8217;s amusing. They can enact any &#8220;international law&#8221; they want. It won&#8217;t affect anyone in the U.S., as it will have no jurisdiction over our sovereignty.  In other words, the US Constitution trumps it. They cannot use it against anyone in a U.S. court of law, nor can they use it to extradite someone from the U.S. to another country.</p>
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		<title>By: Another Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28291</link>
		<dc:creator>Another Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Oct 2008 01:42:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28291</guid>
		<description>A pastor that I spend some time arguing with on a somewhat regular basis spent some time in Pakistan. He had some entertaining stories to tell about being Christian in a Muslim country. 

Basically they screw with you every chance they get. You might be sitting at home minding your own business, and the power will go off. Call the power company, and they&#039;ll tell you that your power has been turned of for non-payment. But, I paid my bill. I&#039;m sorry, you&#039;ll have to come down and talk to someone…Ooops, our mistake, you did pay your bill. Your power gets turned back on…until next month when something else gets screwed with.

Entertainingly, if you get caught proselytizing, you can be put in jail, or put to death. By the way as a non-muslim, you can&#039;t testify in court. If a Muslim says they saw/heard you attempting to talk Christianity, you can get into a huge bunch of trouble.

As an atheist, I found the whole thing more than a little amusing.

Mind you, an atheist wouldn&#039;t fare as well as a Christian, but then again, I&#039;m not likely stupid enough to 1) Go to Pakistan, or 2) Attempt to convert a Muslim.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A pastor that I spend some time arguing with on a somewhat regular basis spent some time in Pakistan. He had some entertaining stories to tell about being Christian in a Muslim country. </p>
<p>Basically they screw with you every chance they get. You might be sitting at home minding your own business, and the power will go off. Call the power company, and they&#8217;ll tell you that your power has been turned of for non-payment. But, I paid my bill. I&#8217;m sorry, you&#8217;ll have to come down and talk to someone…Ooops, our mistake, you did pay your bill. Your power gets turned back on…until next month when something else gets screwed with.</p>
<p>Entertainingly, if you get caught proselytizing, you can be put in jail, or put to death. By the way as a non-muslim, you can&#8217;t testify in court. If a Muslim says they saw/heard you attempting to talk Christianity, you can get into a huge bunch of trouble.</p>
<p>As an atheist, I found the whole thing more than a little amusing.</p>
<p>Mind you, an atheist wouldn&#8217;t fare as well as a Christian, but then again, I&#8217;m not likely stupid enough to 1) Go to Pakistan, or 2) Attempt to convert a Muslim.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Britton</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28277</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Britton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2008 19:50:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28277</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Would you be pro- or anti-lawn bowling??&lt;/blockquote&gt;

That depends on whether I can use some fundies as the pins!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Would you be pro- or anti-lawn bowling??</p></blockquote>
<p>That depends on whether I can use some fundies as the pins!</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28271</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2008 18:34:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28271</guid>
		<description>Would you be pro- or anti-lawn bowling??</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Would you be pro- or anti-lawn bowling??</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Britton</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28184</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Britton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Oct 2008 17:13:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28184</guid>
		<description>Paul:

Yes.  Thank you for that.  I was hoping someone would provide an unbiased link.  When I Googled it, all I found were articles by religious groups.  I wanted something that wasn&#039;t colored by a missionary or anti-Islamic agenda.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul:</p>
<p>Yes.  Thank you for that.  I was hoping someone would provide an unbiased link.  When I Googled it, all I found were articles by religious groups.  I wanted something that wasn&#8217;t colored by a missionary or anti-Islamic agenda.</p>
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		<title>By: PaulJ</title>
		<link>http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie/comment-page-1#comment-28169</link>
		<dc:creator>PaulJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Oct 2008 11:17:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/archives/524/phone-call-from-a-fundie#comment-28169</guid>
		<description>I may be mistaken, but isn&#039;t this what the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.centerforinquiry.net/news/cfi_pushes_back_against_religious_restrictions_on_free_expression_joins_deb/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Center For Inquiry&lt;/a&gt; have been lobbying against at the United Nations?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I may be mistaken, but isn&#8217;t this what the <a href="http://www.centerforinquiry.net/news/cfi_pushes_back_against_religious_restrictions_on_free_expression_joins_deb/" rel="nofollow">Center For Inquiry</a> have been lobbying against at the United Nations?</p>
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